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Published by norzamilazamri, 2022-06-09 02:05:35

Knives Illustrated

Knives Illustrated

knivesillustrated.com KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013 5 1

The Chris Reeve Professional Soldier features a traditional drop-point edge and is ideal of everyday activities and duties.

Granger was getting ready to show about The Professional Soldier’s handle and knife work well in common grips such as forward, reverse, modified saber and
25 of his knives at the 2013 Atlanta Blade saber.
Show when he looked over the Profes-
sional Soldier and Snarl, and gave us his area. For the knife user thinking of striking There’s good, substantial jimping just
professional appraisal. or beating on something with the sloped before the spine’s guard. The jimping
butt, the strikes wouldn’t be very worth- leads into the guard on the spine side, or
Handle – Granger examined the knife while since the butt area is not flat in an top of the knife. The knife’s balance is
and liked the design a lot. He thought the ergonomically way or useful for pounding. slightly above the guard. There’s a double
three-finger handle made it a fine utility
knife. The handle’s cutout reduces the
knife’s weight, and is also designed for
use as a shackle wrench in military marine
and waterborne environments, an espe-
cially good feature for people at sea.

The handle and knife work well in com-
mon grips such as forward, reverse, modi-
fied saber and saber. It doesn’t work well
in the ice-pick grip, but then again that’s
not the type of grip one would care to use
anyway.

The handle can be wrapped in par acord
for those who prefer a thicker handle. The
knife comes with a nylon cord.

There’s an unusual shape to the butt of
the handle, with an intentionally raised

5 2 KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013 knivesillustrated.com

guard that’s small on the spine side of the many special operations folks throughout
knife.
the years. Recently, I evaluated the Chris
Blade – The CRK Professional Soldier
is made of S35VN steel, a really tough Reeve Pacific, which was without a doubt
steel; its HRC 55-57 is made to take a lot
of shock. The blade was sharp out of the one of the best-designed and built cus-
box, with a drop point and hollow grind. A
false edge going inward from the tip on tom fixed-blade knives I’ve ever used. The
the blade’s spine is somewhat sharp. It
has good balance ; the hollow grind takes Professional Soldier had a lot stacked in
a bit of weight off the blade.
its favor to say the least.
The coating, IonBond P.V.D. (Physical
Vapor Deposition), is a vapor deposition Built in collaboration with Bill Harsey
coating, a fine protective coating that’s
nonreflective and protects against rust and the retired and active Special Forces
under harsh conditions.
community, the Professional Soldier is a
Sheath – in stock condition, the sheath
can only be carried in the pocket or with one-pie ce fixed-blade knife with a cut-
cord-tying help around the user’s neck or
on the belt. Actually, a tech-lock/Tek-Lok away handle that can be used specifically
or s imilar after-market belt loop would
need to be attached to make the sheath as a shackle wrench. It comes equipped
compatible for belt or MOLLE carry.
with an excellent sheath made out of Ky-
Professional Soldier
Field Evaluation ABOUT THE REVIEWERS

By Mark Allen Prince Paul Granger is a seasoned knifemaker
who specializes in fixed-blade knives both
Reeve’s Professional Soldier arrived at from traditional patterns and from his own
the castle in the spring. As a young man, unique design. He has created a line of
Reeve’s earlier knives, particularly the lightweight, non-metallic, non-ceramic
ones with hollow handles, always fasci- knives currently in use by the American and
nKated me. Known for their quality, Chris Canadian militaries, multiple police
Reeve knives have been sought after by departments and both the FBI and the CIA.

Mark Allen Prince is a professor of Law
Enforcement Technology/Special
Operations at Central Ohio Technical College,
a former USDOE SRT operator, and spent 18
years in local law enforcement special
operations and training. He has developed
and teaches courses in homeland security
and special operations for military, state,
and local special operations personnel and
organizations. He’s an instructor trainer
certified by the late Colonel Rex Applegate.

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knivesillustrated.com

dex by Blade Tech. It can be lashed, or as a basic mode of carry. The flatness and SPECIFICATIONS
tech-lock/Tek-Lok attached via MOLLE overall moderate length of this knife really
(Modular Lightweight Load-carrying accommodated this mode of carry sur- CHRIS REEVE
Equipment) or slung with a lanyard. prisingly well. PROFESSIONAL SOLDIER

The knife I evaluated over several As the Professional Soldier is not mar- OVERALL LENGTH: 7.25 inches
weeks had the drop-point traditional keted as a survival knife, I decided to forgo BLADE STEEL: CPM S35VN
edge. This, in combination with its overall the usual battery of what many see as BLADE HARDNESS: 55-57 RC
size and variety of carry options, made the abusive tests, but what I see a s mission FINISH: IonBond P.V.D.
Professional Soldier the ideal size for day- important (who wants a tool that fails?). WEIGHT: 3 ounces
in and day-out activities and duties. However, throughout my evaluation I saw SHEATH: Kydex made by Blade Tech
the knife shine in tasks of cutting 550 MSRP: $195
I first carried the Professional Soldier on cord, whittling and carving wood, and
a lanyard slung around my neck under a carving up food like meat and veggies for SOG SNARL
pullover for a few days. This is not my pre- American/ Asian food dishes in the
ferred mode of concealment for a knife, kitchen. OVERALL LENGTH: 4.3 inches
but one that works and is popular with BLADE STEEL: 9Cr18MoV
others. Throughout my normal duties, I The Professional Soldier is an excellent BLADE HARDNESS: HRC 58-60
wanted to see if the knife would fall out of small knife that will handle day-to-day FINISH: Satin
the scabbard since it was upside down chores, and would be an excellent choice WEIGHT: 1.9 ounces
continuously. The knife and sheath for a concealable blade for last - MSRP: $55
wor ked very well regarding this test. ditch/self-defense purposes.
use to market this knife to our community
The next couple of days I shoved the “Compact,” “flat,” “light,” “nimble,” of quiet professionals to whom this coun-
sheath and knife in my blue jeans pocket “sturdy” and “sharp” are words I would try is beloved and I cannot say thank you
to enough. Chris Reeve and Bill Harsey
have done it again in designing and pro-
ducing a fantastic American-made (Ida-
ho, specifically!) knife, for our special op-
erations co mmunity. Well done.

The Professional Soldier's handle cutout is designed for use as a shackle wrench in military marine and SOG Snarl
waterborne environments.
According to SOG Knives
(www.sogknives.com/type/knives/snarl.h
tml) the Snarl was designed in conjunc-
tion with Jason Brous, a 10-year CNC ma-
chinist and custom knifemaker. Brous
prefers to use stock removal and ground
bevels to create his “functional fantasy”
knife designs.

An imprint on the blade of the Professional Soldier certifies it as Idaho-made. The front side of the Professional Soldier bears the marks of designers Bill Harsey and Chris Reeve.

5 4 KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013 knivesillustrated.com

&U\RJHQLFDOO\ 7HDWHG
57-58 HRC

8A Stainless Steel

Mini Serrated
Mini Folder

The Original
605 Folder

The Professional Soldier comes equipped with an excellent sheath made out of Kydex by Blade Tech. It can be
lashed, Tek-Lok attached via MOLLE or slung with a lanyard.

Custom Knifemaker's ward grip. Holding the knife sideway in a Satin Finish
modi fied saber grip is effective.
Review of the SOG Snarl 605 Mini’s %HDG %ODVW )LQLVK
The blade is thick and won’t break. are overall 5
Blade – This is a discreet carry knife There is effective jimping on the top of the 3/4” opened,
designed by Jason Brous, who makes knife that overlaps part of the blade area. 3 3/8”
knives that are freaky looking, functional The knife has good balance. closed.
and very cool. Blade 2 3/8”
Sheath – The knife comes with a nice, long, 11/16”
The knife has a satin finish. Its finger- really good, snap fit, molded nylon sheath. wide, and
ring-grip appearance looks like a brass The sheathed knife can be carried in 3/32” thick.
knuckle, but that’s not the case in real life. about eight different ways: belt, neck,
The steel is 9Cr18Mov, a Chinese steel etc., and locks in really well. 605 Original
made up of .09 percent carbon and 18 is overall 7
percent chromium, with about 1 percent SOG Snarl Field Evaluation 7/8” open, 4
of molybdenum with vanadium added. Its 1/2” closed,
hardness on the Rockwell Scale is HRC The SOG Snarl arrived at the castle on blade is 3
58-60, which makes it a good steel for a drafty and cool early spring morning. It 1/4” long,
cutting. A user could probably filet a fish was delivered in a non-descript brown 7/8” wide,
with it in a survival situation. box. Inside, the Snarl was packaged in an and .114”
attractive (for a weapons enthusiast) box thick.
There is a sheepsfoot design to the with the SOG logo and a plethora of spe-
blade, which is good for cutting ropes, or cific technical information regarding the 3URÀOHG
even activities like cutting articles out of weapon enclosed. This sharp piece of +DQGOHV
the newspaper. There’s a flat grind to the steel was unusual looking, and based
blade and it’s shaving sharp. upon my experience, was designed with a Holes in the profiled handles are drilled and
specific objective in mind. The field evalu- countersunk for proper fit. Handles are a
Using the element of surprise, it might ation was on. bit larger than the liners for final fitting.
be effective defensively in a pending situ- The surface is left flat for final shaping.
ation of a violent nature. It could be effec- The Snarl is a Jason Brous plus SOG Optional jeweled thumb openers and
tive cutting soft body tissue, but could collaboration. It’s a single piece of other handles available. See more at
possibly hurt the user’s hand and force 9Cr18MoV RC. 58-60 steel that weighs 1.9 www.knifemaking.com.
the user to let go if a bone was struck with ounces, is 4.3 inches long, with a blade
the blade. length of 2.3 inches and is of a sheepsfoot CAT.# DESPRIPTION PRICE
design. Special characteristics include a
There’s not any really comfortable way skeletonized handle with a finger ring grip KV605M 605 Mini Folder 24.95
to hold the knife with its two finger-sized (actually there are two finger holes or 24.95
holes se parated like they are. Perhaps it rings in the grip area). It comes with a KV605MS 605 Mini Serrated Folder
would be more comfortable if the two fin- mold ed nylon sheath where the knife 7.95
ger holes were placed closer together. The “snap fits” into, a removable belt clip, and UG203 Mini Red Linen Handle 7.95
best way to hold the knife seems to be a neck chain. 7.95
with just the user’s trigger finger in the UG206 Mini Maroon Linen Handle
hole closest to the blade, although it In the 2003 Webster’s New World Dic-
would get uncomfortable if used for more tionary, the word “knife” is defined as “a UG207 Mini Olive Canvas Handle
than a couple of minutes. A reversed grip cutting instrument with a sharp-edged
is slightly more comfortable than a for- KV605 Original 605 Folder 29.95

UG300 605 Blk/Green Linen Handle 7.95

UG302 605 Black Linen Handle 7.95

UG309 605 Black/Red Linen Handle 7.95

JANTZ
1-800-351-8900

knifemaking.com

PO BOX 584
Davis, OK 73030
Add $9.95 for shipping.

knivesillustrated.com KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013 5 5

The SOG Snarl’s sheepsfoot design makes it good for cutting ropes, or even things like cutting articles out of the newspaper. Its blade is flat ground, and it’s shaving sharp.

PROS OF blade set in the handle.” The Snarl meets this I carried the Snarl continuously for over a
SOLID-FRAME KNIVES definition at its most basic level. And that is month. Along the way, I carried it concealed on
where it shines. Through my evaluation I have its neck chain, concealed inside the beltline of
1) Weight and size reduction: determined that the SOG Snarl is a cutting in- my trousers, and I ran many days with it includ-
Reduced weight with reduced strument… period. Not just a cutting instru- ing completing a 26.2-mile marathon with it
thickness — and often shortened ment, but one that’s designed to cut people. clipped inside my fuel belt. At no time was I
length — are the chief reasons to The Snarl is marketed as a tactical knife. compromised. The little knife conceals well
make a skeletonized knife. The thanks to its design and the design of the
reduced size of a skeletonized The same dictionary that d efines the word scabbard.
knife, and the smaller/lighter “knife” clearly identifies the word “tactical”
sheath that it requires, allows one as an adjective that refers to military maneu- As the knife was designed for a “tactical”
to travel lighter, stow the knife in a vers. We all know our military’s primary pur- purpose, I felt no need to put it through the
smaller area, and use the knife in pose (may God bless them all!), so one usual battery of tests of chopping, smashing
tighter quarters. would conclude that a tactical knife is de- and prying. However, the basic cut tests that
signed for military purposes. Now some will were applied to multiple layers of cardboard
2) Lower cost: A skeletonized insist that all military knives are not de- rendered very positive results.
knife is typically less expensive signed to hurt people, and that is correct.
than a full-handled knife due to However, all knives can be used to hurt peo- The sheepsfoot or Wharncliffe design, the
the lower cost of both materials ple. And once you see and handle the Snarl, thickness of the blade, the factory edge, and
and labor. you will see what I mean. th e fact that the knife is not a folder, give the
user the ability to deliver incredibly powerful
3) Handle material The Snarl is a concealable, one-piece, sharp cuts. Once the full-finger ring grip is achieved,
absorption: Most handle metal instrument that’s primarily designed for the results are astonishing, devastating and
materials allow some absorption, slashing with its extremely sharp factory edge. quite possibly deadly.
but a skeletonized knife has no It’s also well designed for a punching or
place for liquid to hide. thrusting stab. Surprisingly, it’s nimble in fine The full-finger grip is excellent for retaining
cutting tasks that include shaving or whittling the knife in an altercation as it’s almost impos-
4) Cleaning and Sterilization: small items. The aggressive jimping on the sible to remove it from or disarm the user. In the
Because it’s single piece of heat- backside of the ¼-inch-thick blade lends to field evaluation, I sustained many forceful
treated steel with nothing such tasks, and were performed during the blows to the forearm area in an attempt to see
attached but a lanyard, a solid- field evaluation. if I would drop the knife. Although the medial
frame knife can be thoroughly nerve strikes caused my fist to open, the knife
cleaned and disinfected of any
salt, blood, biohazards and
dangerous chemicals with soap
and water, alcohol, or chemical
neutralizers.

5 6 KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013 knivesillustrated.com



CONTACT INFO

CHRIS REEVE KNIVES
2949 S. Victory View Way
Boise, ID 83709
(208) 375-0367
www.chrisreeve.com

SOG
6521 212th St. SW
Lynnwood, WA 98036
(425) 771-6230
www.sogknives.com

was not lost. This is a positive thing as a It’s almost impossible to disarm a user holding the SOG Snarl in the full-ring grip.
fight for your life is a down-and-dirty thing.
way. The SOG Snarl bears a close resem- ual purchase price for a military or public
The Yin to this Yang is that the user blance to Brous’s custom-built “Silent service professional. Be you a soldier or
must achieve a full-finger ring grip to Soldier,” which is a bit more expensive. peace officer, should you need a hideout
achieve such results. If not, I found the knife, the SOG Snarl could give you some-
“half-finger grip” into the ring to be less The SOG website shows the Snarl at thing to smile about. KI
effective, and when punching a target, $55 MSRP, which is an excellent individ-
quite painful.

Minor improvements could include ra-
diusing all the 90-degree cuts from the
circular and ring areas on the knife as well
as those found on the sheath. This would
allow for a smoother, less painful — and
therefore swifter and more effective — us-
age. These modifications could probably
be accomplished in the home armory if so
desired. Also, a dark gray powder coating
variant of this knife could be advanta-
geous at times versus the current satin
finish that’s offered.

It appears that SOG has done it again
in designing and producing an excellent
tool for those of us who go into harm’s

The Snarl’s full-ring grip is excellent for retaining the knife in an altercation. knivesillustrated.com
5 8 KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013

STRONGER. ARPER™

DEALER INQUIRIES CALL 800-548-0835
OR VISIT WWW.UNITEDCUTLERY.COM

EONDTHGE E
LANSKY LEADS THE INDUSTRY IN
KNIFE-SHARPENING SYSTEMS

STORY AND PHOTOS BY PAUL GRANGER,
JIM WEISS AND MICKEY DAVIS

Lansky Sharpeners is perhaps the most widely recog-
nized name in knife sharpening across the globe, and
for good reason.

A privately owned company based in Henderson, Nevada, Lansky is
continually developing innovative sharpening technologies for hunting,
outdoor sports, and kitchen and workshop use. They are known for their
hunting-knife sharpeners and precision sharpening kits.

Our expert reviewer, custom knifemaker Paul Granger, evaluated Lan-
sky’s latest sharpening systems to see how well they live up to the com-
pany’s reputation — and to give his advice on how to use the systems to
their full potential.

PAUL GRANGER’S REPORT

An Introduction to Lansky Sharpeners

Harry Truman once said, “There are about as many ways to do a thing
as there are men who want to do it.” When it comes to knife sharpening,
this may be an understatement. A quick Google image search shows at
least 50 different types of commercial sharpening devices, as well as
pictures and plans to create your own knife sharpeners from belt
sanders, motors and other mechanical marvels that were never intend-
ed to operate near a knife.

6 0 KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013 knivesillustrated.com

This Lansky sharpening kit contains extra coarse, coarse, medium, KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013 6 1
fine, and extra fine grit hones; honing oil; and a knife clamp.

knivesillustrated.com

“LANSKY IS CONTINUALLY Granger secures a
DEVELOPING INNOVATIVE knife in the Lansky
SHARPENING TECHNOLOGIES FOR system clamp.
HUNTING, OUTDOOR SPORTS, AND
KITCHEN AND WORKSHOP USE.”

The Lansky Sharpening System has I could b e successful 99 percent of the sharp. I’ve always told them I use the Lan-
been in use since 1979, and its longevity time. It was an easy decision to make. sky systems. However, I have sometimes
speaks to its popularity and effectiveness. met with the reply: “I have one, but I can’t
It’s designed according to one basic prin- A Foolproof System? get it to work that well.” That’s when I r e-
ciple: You can sharpen a knife most effec- alized that over time, I had developed
tively when each stroke of the blade A knife-sharpening system must clamp some techniques and modifications for
across the sharpening stone (or hone) is your knife in place, thereby ensuring that my benefit, and I began to share my tech-
at the same angle. each stroke brings the blade across the niques with my customers.
stone at the same angle. Otherwise you’re
I’ve been a knife enthusiast since my left with a margin for error. If you’re hold- Techniques and Modifications
youth, and it took me many years to de- ing the knife in your hand and moving it
velop the skills needed to use a whet- across a whetstone, or using either a ce- First, I recommend gluing leather or
stone properly in order to bring a razor ramic rod held in a “V” formation, a ce- rubber pads on both sides of the knife
edge to a knife. Soon after, I discovered ramic or diamond-coated “stick” with a clamp. In the area where the blade touch-
the Lansky Sharpener System. I realized handle on it, or any other abrasive device, es the clamp — from the end of the clamp
that I could use a whetstone and a great it’s too easy for you to rotate the knife a all the way to the screw — I epoxy a pad
deal of care, attention and caution to few degrees in either direction with any — about one millimeter thick. This helps
achieve satisfactory results about 85 per- or perhaps many — of the strokes you protect the finish of the blade, and helps
cent of the time, or I could use the Lansky make. the clamp grip the blade more securely. I
System and, once past the learning curve, had a few tightly clamped blades slip out
There are many other types of sharpen- during sharpening before I added the
ABOUT THE REVIEWER ers, and I’ve tried most of them. I’m sure pads.
people have had varying degrees of suc-
Paul Granger is a seasoned knifemaker who cess, but unless you’ve developed an un- Secondly, be sure that each half of the
specializes in fixed-blade knives both from canny ability to achie ve consistent results knife clamp is exactly parallel to the other.
traditional patterns and from his own unique with your current method, I truly believe If you are a few degrees off parallel, you’re
design. He has created a line of lightweight, non- that you’re wasting time and effort if changing the angle of the hone’s move-
metallic, non-ceramic knives currently in use by you’re not using a clamp and angle sys- ment across the blade, and are grinding a
the American and Canadian militaries, multiple tem like the Lansky. new angle on the edge, thereby defeating
police departments and both the FBI and the the purpose of the Lansky system. It may
CIA. At knife shows, people often stop by my take a bit of time to put the first edge on
table ask me how I get my knives so

6 2 KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013 knivesillustrated.com

For effective use, “IF YOU KEEP THE KNIFE
ensure your knife is CLAMP HALVES PARALLEL,
clamped into the YOU CAN MAKE YOUR
system properly. KNIFE RAZOR SHARP AGAIN
IN TWO MINUTES.”

your knife with the Lansky system, but if you remove material faster (ergo sharpen faster) A RESOURCEFUL
keep the knife clamp halves parallel each time than regular hones. I use the medium standard SOLUTION
you use it, you can make your knife razor sharp hone and an old, fine standard hone LS600
again in two minutes. made during the 1990s, which I feel is superior As it’s currently
to the fine standard hone made today. For an designed, the Lansky
I did have one recurring problem with the extra-fine hone, I use the Black Hard Arkansas, System will barely
Lansky System. The thumbscrews that hold the as the standard Extra Fine Ceramic hone with accommodate blades 3/16
guide rods tight into the hone assemblies tend- the yellow handle loads up too quickly with of an inch thick. Many
ed to work loose, pivot and come out of align- metal filings, and is very difficult to clean. knives are made in this
ment with the surface of the hone. When re- thickness, and a few are as
peated tightening failed, I began to epoxy or Once you have your hones in order, I recom- thick as 5/16 of an inch and
Loctite the thumbscrews in place. That took mend the following method: 3/8 of an inch. In order to
care of the problem. use the Lansky to sharpen
• Begin sharpening by making about 10 to 12 knives that are thicker,
Effective Use Granger uses Phillips-head
strokes on each side of the knife. Continue with screws that are longer than
The specific hones I’ve found to be most effi- the grit you’re using until you feel a burr or wire the screws that come with
cient are the extra-coarse and the coarse dia- edge form on the opposite side from the sharp- the sharpener. The two
mond hones, because diamond hones really do ening stone. When you move to the next grit, screws on the knife clamp
each have 1/2-inch-long
Note the difference between the Standard Fine Hone (LS600) made in the 1990s (top) and the one being made today (bottom). Also bodies, so Granger keeps a
note that the guide rod has been epoxied in place on the upper hone. The upper hone was originally in a blue handle just like the pair of screws with a ¾-inch
lower one. and 1-inch bodies in his
Lansky kit to be prepared
for those thick-knife
occasions.

knivesillustrated.com KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013 6 3

If you have trouble with your blade slipping, Granger Granger demonstrates his method of moving the hone The ultimate test of a sharpening job is will it effortlessly
recommends epoxying leather or rubber pads to both across the blade. Always be sure to keep a clean cloth at shave hair? Granger finds that it does.
sides of the clamp. hand (as shown) to wipe the metal filings off the knife
and the hone.

start off on the side with the burr in order gle on each side of the blade before mov- AN OLD FAVORITE
to knock it off with your first stroke or two. ing on to the next finer grit. However,
Then continue per the directions. The when sharpening a single (chisel) ground At the 2013 Blade Show, Lansky CEO
Lansky System is very effective at sharp- blade, you would take 10 to 12 strokes at Christopher Fire told Paul Granger that
ening a knife with a chisel grind (ex: Emer- the 40-degree angle on the ground side, Lansky is considering once again offering the
son Knives). This is a grind that seems to then take five to seven strokes at the 17- LS600 pink ceramic hone as was made in the
give a lot of knife enthusiasts a bit of trou- degree angle on the unground side. Re- 1990s. This is great news for knife
peat this from the coarsest grit necessary enthusiasts, as the older version of the
•ble. down to the finest grit. (Please note: The LS600 works much better than today’s
When sharpening a double-ground recipe of angles and stroke quantities list- version.
blade, as found on most knives, you would ed here are for illustration. Your knife may
take 10 to 12 strokes at the 20-degree an- require different angles and number of Sharpen the 2.5 inches on either side of
the clamp. Repeat until you have sharp-
A knife clamp, hone •strokes.) ened all the way to the tip.
and knife are The Lansky Sharpening System works
positioned for use. very well on longer blades. Ten-, 24-, and In Conclusion
36-inch blades are no problem. Simply
place the blade clamp about 2.5 inches You’ll find value where quality, afford-
from the handle, then sharpen the 2.5 ability and function intersect. There are
inches on either side of the clamp. When other clamp and angle sharpening sys-
you’re finished in that area, move the tems available, but virtually all of the oth-
clamp down 5 inches toward the tip. er ones are either too expensive, too plas-
tic, or too large and complex to be
portable. The Lansky system is a top op-
tion in both usability and value, and will
make a great long-time companion for
any knife user. KI

CONTACT INFO knivesillustrated.com

Lansky Sharpeners
P.O. Box 800
Buffalo, NY 14231
Phone: (800) 825-2675
Website: www.lansky.com

6 4 KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013



KNIFEMAKERS WEIGH IN ON THEIR PREFERRED STEELS

BY BETHANY MILLER
PHOTOS COURTESY OF MANUFACTURERS

STEEL type can make or break a knife — quite literally.

Consequently, if you’re looking to pur- However all of these steels take a

chase a blade or even forge your own, it great amount of care to keep well main-

pays to be familiar with your spectrum tained, and many users find it too much

of choices. With so many options, an of a hassle for a pocketknife that might

even greater variety of knife styles, and a see mud, sand and an apple core all in

greater range still of users’ expectations, the same day. In addition, while a sword

it’s no wonder why steel is a topic of de- owner may never need to sharpen the

bate amongst knife enthusiasts. blade, the ability of the customer to put

While no one steel is perfect for every a good edge on their knife without much

knife or every purpose, experts in the fuss is a big concern.

field do have their preferences, and they When evaluating our new Russian-

were willing to tell us why. made knife line, Kizlyar Supreme, we

had the option of offering two stainless

BLAKE POGUE, steels — 440C and AUS-8 — and what

ACTING PRODUCT MANAGER, many classify as semi-stainless, D2. Af-

CAS IBERIA ter it was obvious Kizlyar Supreme was

At CAS Iberia, we hold many of the doing a good job heat treating all three

simple high-carbon steels such as 1095, of the steel choices, we decided to carry

T10 and 1060 in high regard. Many work all of them so the knife user could de-

well for the longer blade lengths we are cide what was most important for what

producing in our reproduction sword they were going to put the knife through.

lines. 440C and AUS-8 are more-than-ade-

More recently, marquenched 5160 has quate steels to stand up to harsh condi-

become one of our most popular op- tions where corrosion is a concern or

tions in sword lengths where the superi- when the act of giving a blade a wipe

or shock absorption of the steel com- with oil everyday just isn't wanted.

bined with a mid-high level carbon These steels both take a good edge

content leads to very tough and resilient without much practice, and while they

blades. might need a touch-up to the edge,

6 6 KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013 knivesillustrated.com

knivesillustrated.com “THE ABILITY OF THE
CUSTOMER TO PUT A GOOD

EDGE ON THEIR KNIFE
WITHOUT MUCH FUSS IS A BIG

CONCERN.”

— Blake Pogue

KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013 6 7

The blade of CAS Iberia’s Supreme Biker Z is made from D2 steel.

“THE 400 SERIES more often it's a simple matter to get a hair- 410 is a harden-able, straight-chromium
REMAINS ONE OF popping edge. stainless steel which combines superior wear
THE MOST resistance with excellent corrosion resistance.
POPULAR CHOICES D2, on the other hand, takes a little practice 416 is very similar to 410, with the addition of
FOR KNIFEMAKERS to sharpen well, but after a few trial runs with sulfur to improve machinability. 420 has more
BECAUSE IT’S EASY your sharpening method you've got a great carbon than 410, but less than 440. As such it’s
TO SHARPEN AND edge that will keep on cutting. D2 doesn't really softer than 440, but has a higher toughness.
IT’S RESISTANT TO rust like simple high-carbon steels, but will spot
CORROSION.” tarnish over time. An occasional wipe-down 420HC has a higher carbon content 420
with a n oily rag will keep it looking good. stainless. The HC stands for “high carbon” and
— CHRISTOPHER COSTA this steel can be brought to a higher hardness
CHRIS CASBAUGH, than 420, which is an inexpensive, highly corro-
SENIOR MARKETING MANAGER, sion-resistant steel. Knife manufacturers use
420 in budget knives, and also in diving knives
SOG KNIVES due to its high resistance to corrosion.

For a large portion of our knives we use AUS- 440A is relatively a low-cost, highly corro-
8 stainless steel. Overall performance and cost sion-resistant stainless steel. 440B is almost
are the biggest reasons for this. We have been identical to 440A, but has a higher carbon con-
using AUS-8 for many years, and because of tent range compared to 440A. 440C is consid-
our familiarity with the steel we can reliably get ered a high-end stainless steel. It’s very resist-
a good heat treatment on it. This allows us to ant to corrosion and is one of the most
maximize the performance of the ste el, offering common stainless alloys used for knifemaking.
a really solid solution to the compromise be- We utilize 440A and 440C primarily across our
tween hardness, user serviceability and cost. SAK product line.

CHRISTOPHER COSTA, FRED FEIGHTNER,
DIRECTOR OF PRODUCT MEDIA RELATIONS MANAGER,
MANAGEMENT AND PACKAGING,
VICTORINOX SWISS ARMY W.R. CASE

The 400 series remains one of the most pop- Case has been using its Tru-Sharp surgical
ular choices for knife makers because it’s easy steel for decades. In fact, we’ve been using
to sharpen and it’s resistant to corrosion. stainless steel at Case since it first came onto

6 8 KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013 knivesillustrated.com

The SOG Flashback is an example of an AUS-8 blade.

the manufacturing scene. Most knife Occasionally Case has produced knives
manufacturers today are using a high-car- as special projects with stainless and
bon stainless, generally either 420 or 440 non-stainless blades made from designer
steel, for pocket folder blades. So the real steels like Damascus, BG-42 and others.
difference in blade performance is more Our annual Tony Bose custom col labora-
dependent upon the heat treatment of tions call for 154-CM stainless steel
the steel. blades. We also use that steel in our Desk
knives because it’s very hard and resists
We’ve found with our heat treating that wear. The hardness makes it a little
we get superior strength, edge-holding tougher to sharpen quickly, but once you
and overall wear resistance from our get a nice edge on a 154-CM steel blade it
stainless steel. Case consumers rely on will stand up to a lot of use before re-
our Tru-Sharp surgical blades for knives sharpening is needed.
they use every day.
THE ROCKWELL
There are lots of folks who still like our HARDNESS SCALE
original carbon steel, and that’s where our
chrome vanadium (CV) steel comes into The Rockwell scale was an innovation of
play. Even though CV steel ends up being metallurgist Stanley P. Rockwell designed to
a bit softer than our stainless — it’s more determine the hardness of particular metals.
prone to rusting, pitting and staining — In the simplest terms, the system works by
the people who use our CV steel regul arly putting a blade underneath a particular
swear by its easy sharpening and edge-re- pressure load and measuring the depth of the
tention qualities. In fact, we’ve added indents. Softer steels, according to the
more patterns with CV steel blades to our Rockwell test, include 420 and GIN-1 (or G2),
catalogs over the last few years specifi- while ATS-34 and BG-42 are among the
cally for this growing community of CV harder steels. Most commonly used steel
enthusiasts. types range between 56 and 60 on the
Rockwell scale.

knivesillustrated.com KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013 6 9

JAY FISHER, These Fisher custom chef knives are made from CPM 154CM, a particularly high-quality steel.
MASTER SMITH,
JAY FISHER CUTLERY “THE REAL DIFFERENCE IN BLADE PERFORMANCE IS MORE
DEPENDENT UPON THE HEAT TREATMENT OF THE STEEL.”
The modern, full-time professional
knifemaker may use many types of steel — FRED FEIGHTNER
for blades, and others for fittings, bol-
sters, guards, ancillary devices, sheaths and durable a blade you want and are be resharpened according to how often
and stands. In my studio, these materials willing to pay for; what your tolerance is they are used. As you go up in price from
define a system, not simply a cutting for blade maintenance (resha rpening and there, blade hardness, edge retention
edge. cleaning). (how long the blade stays sharp) and rust
protection get better and better.
Currently, I use more than a dozen The Camillus brand strives to offer cus-
types of steel for my blad es, and half a tomers a variety of choices. Most of our Three of our most popular, premium
dozen types of pattern-welded Damas- blades are made from stainless steel, to knife alloys are 440 series, AUS-8, and
cus. The decision of the type of steel cho- provide lasting performance. By varying VG-10. The 440 series are workhorse
sen for any particular project involves the the amount of chromium and carbon in steels suitable for a variety of end uses. It
ultimate knife client, user or owner. I use the steel, different properties can be was the top-selling blade alloy in the
three categories and 12 specific features achieved. Value-priced sport and hunting 1980s. AUS-8 comes only from Japan and
to determine the blade type for each of knives come with an entry-level stainless represents a step up in performance. It
my customers. contains higher chromium plus vanadium,
steel usually made in China. While which will improve edge retention and
It’s important to know that there’s no they have good all-around cut- wear resistance. The ultimate alloy in the
ultimate, super steel; if there were, it t ing function, they need to
would replace all others in the industrial,
militar y and medical fields, and thus be
reflected in knifemaking. Each steel has
its pros and cons. Ultimately, performance
of a particular steel for a specific applica-
tion is more determined by the correct,
certain, and accurate heat treating, hard-
ening and tempering, and processing of
the blade than the simple choice.

LARRY BUCHTMANN,
VICE PRESIDENT

OF TECHNOLOGY, CAMILLUS

A great many things determine the cut-
ting performance that a user will experi-
ence — among them
blade thickness
and shape,
edge grind
quality, and
heat treat-
ment but it all
starts with the
blade alloy.

The main factors in se-
lecting a blade alloy are:
what kinds of things you will be cutting;
how often you will use the knife; how hard

DON’T FORGET… The blade of W.R. Case’s Desk knife is made from
154-CM stainless steel.
While steel type is certainly important,
experienced knifemakers tend to agree that
the treatment of the steel has equally
significant bearing on the quality and
performance of a blade.

7 0 KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013 knivesillustrated.com

Victorinox Swiss Army products, KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013 7 1
such as the Classic SD pocketknife,
typically feature blades made from
steels within the 400 series.

Camillus brand is VG-10, which also
comes from Japan. It contains vanadium
plus two additional elements to provide
more wear-resistance and more corro-
sion-protection than any other alloy we
have tested.

MIKE VELLEKAMP,
OWNER, FOX KNIVES USA

I like S30V because it’s a tough powder
metal that‘s pretty easy to grind and is
well known for great edge retention. I
grind after heat-treating. S30V can be
tough on belts and wheels but well worth
the extra cost.

154CM, which is a modification of 440C
stainless with molybdenum added, is also
a staple for us. Originally developed for
tough industrial uses, it makes for a great
premium grade stainless knife steel.

At Fox Italy and Fox USA, we also use
Austrian N690 (N690Co), which is similar
to 440C, but with c obalt and vanadium
added. It grinds and sharpens easily and
holds a great edge.

440C is another great stainless steel
from the 400 series. 440C is much less
expensive than S30V, 154CM, or N690. It
grinds and polishes nicely and is a well-
known and much-used steel in the knife
industry.

I really like the performance of AUS 8
for the price point. AUS-8 is a Japanese
steel and is similar to 440C. It has less
ca rbon than 440C, but it has vanadium
added and I have found it to be pretty
tough. KI

knivesillustrated.com

FOR THE
INDOORSMAN

12TCohpef’s Knives

BY BETHANY MILLER
PHOTOS COURTESY OF MANUFACTURERS

While large blocks of assorted knives are a common fixture in
most households, all that the typical, everyday chef really
needs are two or three high-quality pieces of cutlery.

For one thing, blades will dull far more quickly after being moved into and out of a
block repeatedly than they will being stored safely elsewhere. But more importantly,
most cooking-related tasks can be easily accomplished with a bread knife, paring knife
and 8- to 10-inch chef’s knife. It makes more sense in most cases, therefore, to invest in
high-quality versions of those three knives.

To guide your purchasing decisions, we’ve gathered a selection of 12 knives highly
praised by culinary enthusiasts.

THE CLASSICS

For chefs who prefer their tools a little more traditional.

1. Henckels Chef’s Knife

BLADE: 8 inches, high-carbon stainless steel
HANDLE: Features triple rivets and full bolster
COUNTRY OF ORIGIN: Spain
MSRP: $67.95 at A.G. Russell

7 2 KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013 knivesillustrated.com

2. Victorinox Swiss Classic 3. Victorinox Rosewood
Straight Edge Chef’s Knife Collection Santoku

BLADE: 8 inches, high-carbon stainless steel BLADE: 7 inches, high-carbon stainless steel
HANDLE: Polyproylene — ergonomic and slip resistant HANDLE: Rosewood, triple-rivet design
COUNTRY OF ORIGIN: Switzerland COUNTRY OF ORIGIN: Switzerland
MSRP: $50 MSRP: $61.40
NOTE: This knife is made to be dishwasher safe. NOTE: Includes lifetime warranty against
manufacturer defects.
4. Victorinox Rosewood
Collection Chef’s Knife 5. Richmond
Kohetsu Gyutou
BLADE: 8 inches
HANDLE: Rosewood, triple-rivet design BLADE: Aogami super with stainless
COUNTRY OF ORIGIN: Switzerland steel cladding
MSRP: $64.90 HANDLE: Ho wood with buffalo horn
NOTE: Includes lifetime warranty against ferrules
manufacturer defects. COUNTRY OF ORIGIN: Japan
MSRP: $169.95 from Chef Knives to Go
6. Korin Special Inox PHOTO COURTESY: Scott Sebastian
Yo-Deba Butcher Knife

BLADE: 8.2 inches, special-grade AUS-10
stainless steel
HANDLE: Polyoxymethylene
COUNTRY OF ORIGIN: Japan
MSRP: $278

knivesillustrated.com KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013 7 3

THE UNIQUE knivesillustrated.com

For those who like a knife with a bit of
artistic flair.

7. A.G. Russell
Japanese Chef’s Knife

BLADE: 8.25 inches, VG-10 stainless steel
HANDLE: White Corian with triple rivets
COUNTRY OF ORIGIN: Japan
MSRP: $149.95

8. Ken Onion Rain Series
8-inch Chef’s Knife

BLADE: 7.75 inches, CTS-BDZ1 stainless steel
HANDLE: G10 Garolite
COUNTRY OF ORIGIN: USA
MSRP: $169.95 from A.G. Russell

9. Miyabi Artisan SG2
Collection Santoku

BLADE: 7 inches, SG2 microcarbide core with
hammered stainless steel cladding
HANDLE: Cocobolo Rosewood pakkawood
COUNTRY OF ORIGIN: Japan
MSRP: $250 from Sur La Table
NOTE: Blade features Damascus texturing and
katana edge.

10. Miyabi Artisan SG2
Collection Chef’s Knife

BLADE: 9.5 inches, SG2 microcarbide core with
hammered stainless steel cladding
HANDLE: Cocobolo Rosewood pakkawood
COUNTRY OF ORIGIN: Japan
MSRP: $290 from Sur La Table
NOTE: Blade features Damascus texturing
and katana edge.

11. Miyabi Birchwood
Paring Knife

BLADE: 4.5 inches, SG2 microcarbide core with
stainless Damascus cladding
HANDLE: Masur birchwood
COUNTRY OF ORIGIN: Japan
MSRP: $240 from Sur La Table
NOTE: Includes limited lifetime warranty.

7 4 KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013

12. Korin Cutting Edge Artists Choose Tormach Mills
Togiharu
Nickel Knifemakers around the world are using Tormach PCNC milling machines to add new dimensions to
Damascus their craft. Today’s top blade artists are embracing CNC technology to shape and sculpt blades and
Gyutou handles, cut precision blade locks and other mechanisms,
and customize designs with engraving and detail.
BLADE: 10.5 inches,
63-layer nickel Damascus Tormach PCNC 1100 Series 3
HANDLE: Composite wood
COUNTRY OF ORIGIN: Japan starting at $8480
MSRP: $269
NOTE: Works for right- or (plus shipping)
left-handed use.
Follow knifemaker John Grimsmo as he
CONTACT INFO makes his own knives with a PCNC 1100 on
his web series, Knifemaking Tuesdays, at
A.G. RUSSELL www.tormach.com/kmt.
2900 S. 26th St.
Rogers, AR 72758 Shown here with optional
(800) 255-9034 stand, LCD monitor, machine
www.agrussell.com arms, and accessories.
CHEF KNIVES TO GO
2141 University Ave. Grimsmo Knives milling a fixed blade, called
Madison, WI 53726 The Tor, on a Tormach PCNC 1100.
Email: [email protected]
www.chefknivestogo.com www.tormach.com/knives
KORIN
57 Warren St. KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013 7 5
New York, NY 10007
(800) 626-2172
www.korin.com
SUR LA TABLE
P.O. Box 840
Brownsburg, IN 46112
(317) 858-5521
www.surlatable.com
VICTORINOX SWISS ARMY
7 Victoria Drive
Monroe, CT 06468
(800) 442-2706
www.victorinox.com KI
knivesillustrated.com

BELLS &

WHISTLES

IfdoeraKlnSifteocOkwinngeSrstuffers

BY ABE ELIAS
PHOTOS COURTESY OF MANUFACTURERS

MYTH knivesillustrated.com
SHOTGUN
MULTITOOL

The Myth Shotgun
Multitool by Gerber was
developed specifically for
the shotgun shooter/
hunter. It comes with a pin
drive, choke-tube wrench,
knife saw and measuring
tape. It’s handy for cleaning
your game or cleaning your
gun and would make a
great gift for the upland or
small-game hunter in your
life.
MSRP: $40

7 6 KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013

KLECKER CRKT VEFF
KNIVES SHARP
TRIGGER
Designed by Tom Veff, the
Ready to introduce your kids Veff Sharp is a compact,
to the world of knife versatile sharpening tool.
collecting? Klecker has made On one side, the diamond-
it easier to do just that. They coated rod is available in
offer a number of designs in diameters ranging from
fully functional model knives .093 inches to .085 inches,
to help people teach youth to making it great for tackling
handle and appreciate cutlery. any rounded serration
Pictured here, the Trigger patterns. On the opposite
model is available in a variety side is 6 inches of flat
of colored plastics that you surface for sharpening
can even paint to look more straight edges. With its
realistic if you so desire. rod-like style and knurled
MSRP: $9.95 aluminum handle, the Veff
Sharp can be used in a file
knivesillustrated.com fashion, allowing you to
sharpen anything from
axes and large machetes to
small pocketknives. It
comes with its own
carrying case.
MSRP $49.99

KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013 7 7

CRKT EAT’N TOOL XL

For those of us knife users who love the outdoors, CRKT’S Eat’N Tool is
just the thing for long treks. Made from Cr13 stainless, it’s a spork
(spoon/fork) that also incorporates a number of other tools such as a
bottle opener, can opener, flat-head screwdriver and a hex wrench cut-
out ranging from .028 inches to .5 inches.
MSRP $14.99

LEATHERMAN CAM,
PUMP AND RAIL

Leatherman has come out with three new area-specific tools.
The cam tool is designed for the archery crowd, with a number
of tools for crossbows and a broad-head wrench. The pump
was made with the shotgun hunter in mind and features a pin
punch, long screwdriver bits and a choke wrench, amongst
other features. Lastly, designed for tactical shooters, the rail
offers tools for AR platform rifles, a sight-adjustment wrench,
a bit holder and other tools. Both the cam and the pump
come with gut hooks.
MSRP $40 TO $45

LED LENSER P4BM FLASHLIGHT knivesillustrated.com

You can find LEDs for sale in all shapes and sizes, including LED
Lenser’s powerful pen-sized LED. It works great as a bore light or
as a small work light for tight places. It includes a focusable lens,
pen clip and carrying case. The light casts out to 27 meters and
uses two ordinary AAA batteries.
MSRP $24.99

7 8 KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013

CONTACT INFO PROVEN,
LIKE THE
COLUMBIA RIVER KNIFE AND TOOL TEAMS THAT
(800) 891-3100 USE THEM.
www.crkt.com

GERBER
(855) 544-0150
www.gerbergear.com

KLECKER KNIVES AND TOOLS
(503)-930-5087
www.kleckerknives.com

LEATHERMAN TOOL GROUP, INC.
(503) 253-7826
www.leatherman.com

LED LENSER
(800) 650-1245
www.ledlenser.com

SPYDERCO
(800) 828-1925
www.spyderco.com

FORGED

OUT OF TRADITION.

HARDENED

IN THE FIELD.

HONED

FROM EXPERIENCE.

SOG knives and tools are born of the military, preferred
by U.S. Special Forces teams for decades. So whether
you’re answering the call of duty or arming yourself with
innovation, lead the way with SOG. sogknives.com

TAKE POINT.TM

SPYDERCO KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013 7 9
SPYDERPACS

One challenge knife users face is transporting
our knives both safely and easily. Spyderco’s
SpyderPacs, small and large, may be the
perfect solution. SpyderPac’s clear pockets
eliminate the need to blindly guessing at where
you put each knife, and there’s no crowding —
each knife can have its own pocket so you can
easily tell where each of your knives are.
MSRP SMALL $39.99, LARGE $49.99 KI

knivesillustrated.com

AD INDEX

5.11 TACTICAL SERIES 11 NIAGARA SPECIALTY METALS 69
53
A.G. RUSSELL KNIVES 39 ONTARIO KNIFE COMPANY 71
59
BEAR AND SON CUTLERY 57 PARACORD 80
49, 79
BLADE HQ 47 PAT CRAWFORD KNIVES 71
13
BLUE RIDGE KNIVES 13, 80 RANDALL MADE KNIVES 49
59
CAMPCO 3, 5 SOG SPECIALTY KNIVES 9
75
COAST PRODUCTS 33, 81 SPARTAN BLADES USA 75
79
COLONIAL KNIFE COMPANY 41 SPYDERCO INC. 59
2
DIAMOND MACHINING TECHNOLOGY 53 TANDY LEATHER FACTORY 75

EAGLE GRIPS 69 TIM BRITTON

FAMARS USA 83 TOPS KNIVES

GREATEASTERNCUTLERY 29 TORMACH LLC

HALLMARK CUTLERY 71 TRU-GRIT, INC.

JANTZ SUPPLY 37, 42-43, 45, 55 TUFF-WRITER

JOHN H. DAVIS CUSTOM KNIFE MA 81 UNITED CUTLERY CORPORATION

KERSHAW KNIVES 84 W.R. CASE & SONS CUTLERY CO.

KNIFE AND GUN FINISHING SUPPLY 19, 41 WILSON COMBAT

KNIFE CENTER OF THE INTERNET 13

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www.KnivesIllustrated.com

The premier
knife magazine

s The hottest knives and latest
innovations in steel and design

s

&SHTOEWLL Show and Tell is a new column that appears at the end of every issue
of Knives Illustrated. In it, readers tell us about their favorite knives
from their own personal collections. Interested in showing off your
knife? Email Bethany Miller at [email protected].

BY KI STAFF
PHOTOS BY FRANCESCA WILBURN

1. How long have you had this knife?
I made this knife for my Master Smith review by a panel of
seven American Bladesmith Society judges in April 2013.

2. What was your thought process in designing it?
I wanted a hefty blade to show off the intricate Damas-
cus — and a blade like this deserves a handle to match. I
made this Bowie specifically as an art knife, but it’s also
made for the highest level of performance. With my
knives, form always follows function.

3. What is its most unique feature or your favorite
feature?
The Damascus steel.

4. Have you made other knives for your own personal
collection? If so, how many and what types?
I make many knives for others to enjoy. My culinary line is
especially popular.

5. Do you have any advice for other knifemakers or
collectors?
Anytime you can afford a Master Smith test knife for your
collection, you should get it. It’s a once-in-a-lifetime op-
portunity to get one of the knives a Master Smith passed
his review test with. KI

8 2 KNIVES ILLUSTRATED • DECEMBER 2013 ABOUT THE OWNER

NAME: Aaron Wilburn
CITY AND STATE OF RESIDENCE: Redding, CA
OCCUPATION: Full-time knifemaker

KNIFE INFO

MANUFACTURER: Wilburn Forge
MODEL: Snakewood frame handle Bowie

knivesillustrated.com



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A blackwashed knife is like a battle-tested tool or a favorite pair of
well-worn jeans. Knife components are Tungsten DLC coated, then
tumbled to produce the already-broken-in look. Like any coating, it
will wear eventually, but with blackwashing, who cares? Additional
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